Skybusting, The Media and ammo companies

This is a topic that burns my ass and I think a lot of you will agree.

Ammunition companies seem to be in a frenzy to market "High Velocity", "Extended Range" , "3 1/2" " , "Tighter pattern at 50 yards" and more. Why?? So that we can all shoot ducks at 50-60 yards like the "Professionals" do? Which brings me to the second point - videos and films of duck hunting.

You can browse youtube and see all kinds of crazy shit these people do on the marsh, but non more prevalent than skybusting! Even so called "professionals" love filming videos where a flock of ducks gets blasted at 50+ yards. Ducks Unlimited is guilty as anything for this with their "DU TV" series. I've seen time and time again guys shooting at birds well outside the decoys. Sure, the camera has an effect on judging distance, but when you see a bird fall well beyond their decoy spread, you can come up with a good idea of just how "far" these guys are shooting at birds.

What distance does the average hunter set their decoy spreads? I'd venture to guess it is around 10-30 yards. So when a bird falls well outside the decoys, you can assume that's 40+ yards. What is this telling duck hunters, especially "new" duck hunters, about the ethics of our sport? That if a duck is within 50 yards to shoot? This is unacceptable!

Anybody that has ever gunned with me knows, that I will chew your head off if you shoot at ducks outside 30 yards! If you can't get ducks coming feet down over your decoys - you're doing it wrong! 95% of the ducks I kill are 20-30 yard shots on decoying birds. You'd probably think I'm crazy at the amount of shots I "pass up" on birds that are well within range because I like my ducks on final approach.

I think Delta Waterfowl should start a campaign to remind waterfowl hunters that shots outside 35 yards greatly increase the chances of crippled birds and birds that become unretrievable. It chaps my ass when a "Conservation Organization" endorses "Extended range" ammo and films videos of ducks getting blasted beyond what should be an ethical distance.

Discuss!

Great topic:

I always try to set a decoy out on the outside of my spread at 30 yards. This is a marker for my hunting buddies to not shoot outside that decoy.

A friend took a shot at a goose this year at over 50 yards and crippled it (After I told him not to shoot). It dropped at least 1/4 mile plus away on the other side of the muddy cornfield. Told him to fetch it up. He had to walk the edge of the field so as to not spook other birds, making his walk close to a mile round trip. I think the walk did him some good. He only shot at birds decoying in the rest of the day...

Learning to hunt from tv shows and videos is like learning to make love from a porno. If we're depending on tv to help anybody learn anything, God help us all.

That said, be careful applying situational ethics... I don't so nobody should... we routinely SMOKE snow geese at 55 yards, and have flipped them over backwards at 65-70 yards with pellets passing all the way through the breast bone. Difference is a white bird that is crippled shows up about 500 yards away where I hunt... after 2 windy days you can burn an afternoon riding around and getting a dog out to pick up cripples off the side of the road, great way to pass the time and if you got a driver, a great way to drink whiskey and have a ball.

Everybody wants the best... who in the world would advertise shells with, they'll kill them if everything is right! hehe. Somehow hunting ads became rough and tough, oh well. They use sex to sell ice cream on tv so go figger!

ya know the funny thing about the interweb... none of the skybusters get on it. never been to a duck sight before where people say, yeah I like to skybust, shoot at corn-a-mints after blowing a goose call at em, and set up 50 yards from folks... but we all know it happens everyday across the country.

Travis Bruce wrote:Learning to hunt from tv shows and videos is like learning to make love from a porno.
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Dude you almot made me spill my tea on laptop, hillarious analogy!!!

That reminds me to buy some ice cream on my way home from work. Thanks guys.

gotta quit surfing the web....

Russell Vrhovac wrote:That reminds me to buy some ice cream on my way home from work. Thanks guys.

gotta quit surfing the web....

Don't quit surfing the web!! Its good for maintaining a sense of humor!

So anyone who shoots over 30 yards is a douchebag

RUT ROW SHAGGY! travis

Mike B wrote:So anyone who shoots over 30 yards is a douchebag

LOL! Hardly the case, we all know there are days when birds won't stool but you get 30-40yrd passing shots that we take. I'm just saying that the guy who constantly brings his gun up for 40+ yard birds needs to learn to be patient and pay more attention to decoy placement, location and hiding well!

Guys that shoot at 50+ yard birds are douche bags.

This year was the worst I'd seen it for skybusters. You can ask Donofrio, when we're gunning together and you hear 1 shot, 1 duck was bagged over the decoys. When you hear 2 shots, 2 ducks are dead...because at 20 yards its hard to miss! I probably use less ammo than most, yet still bag more ducks.

Last day of the south zone season, I shot my limit of 4 mallards and 1 black duck. I had 8 spent shells, and few were to finish off a cripple to make it easy for the dog. Every bird was back winging over my dekes at 20 yards, easy shots.

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If you hear a splast then it was probably my gun as I threw it in the water after missing a 20yd shot because I was drinking coffee and eating a ho-ho. The subsequent splashes is the rest of the flock lifting out of the decoys in front of me.

I take my shots when I am confident that I am going to stone the bird. Everyone's shooting capabilities are different and eveyone shoots better at certain ranges and positions. I shoot Black Cloud #3 because I consistently kill more birds stone dead with one shot and very rarely do I need to dispatch a cripple and I like to shoot between 30-40 AFTER they have come into the decoys. Why? Because I don't want to shred the meat. Not picking a fight here Davey but it chews my ass when others tell me how I should hunt and how far I should shoot. That I should hunt over hand carved decoys, that I should do this and that and then to see them go out and shoot 2-3 Black ducks. I may have broken "davey's law" but these guys are breaking Federal Law. And I am not saying that this is you but those guys who go out and shoot above the limit and over the limit of a certain species have no right telling other what to do.

Your previous post states that you will chew someone's ass for a 30+ yarder because that is skybusting and you will cripple birds. You further state that 20 yard shots are easy yet you still had to do follow up shots on cripples???

I do believe that 20 yards shots are harder though. Your gun will typically have no pattern at that range. If I were expecting 20 yard shots, I would shoot a skeet choke. For all else I shoot IC. But, this is my gun, my shooting abilities.

If I am hunting flooded timber then of course my shots are 15-25 yards and with #6 Steel.

I love me a skeet choke... under 35 yards with no wind, its the bag! I shoot an improved and #2 xspurts if the winds not blowing, and bb's and a patternmaster if it is. 10.50 a box and if Im not in a slump can consistantly kill ducks dead further away than I care to shoot. bbb's will kill snows like I said, stone cold dead at 60-70 yards.. shot some #2 home defense loads this year that where tungstun brass or some crap like that, heavier than lead and they swat snows like a tennis racket.

If I let ducks land, 90% of the time they'd be out of range. We hunt huge spreads the most of the time and we set up for the shot, not to land. Like mike said, everyones abilites are different, but moreso there normal days hunt is. travis

Mike B wrote:I take my shots when I am confident that I am going to stone the bird. Everyone's shooting capabilities are different and eveyone shoots better at certain ranges and positions. I shoot Black Cloud #3 because I consistently kill more birds stone dead with one shot and very rarely do I need to dispatch a cripple and I like to shoot between 30-40 AFTER they have come into the decoys. Why? Because I don't want to shred the meat. Not picking a fight here Davey but it chews my ass when others tell me how I should hunt and how far I should shoot. That I should hunt over hand carved decoys, that I should do this and that and then to see them go out and shoot 2-3 Black ducks. I may have broken "davey's law" but these guys are breaking Federal Law. And I am not saying that this is you but those guys who go out and shoot above the limit and over the limit of a certain species have no right telling other what to do.

Your previous post states that you will chew someone's ass for a 30+ yarder because that is skybusting and you will cripple birds. You further state that 20 yard shots are easy yet you still had to do follow up shots on cripples???

I do believe that 20 yards shots are harder though. Your gun will typically have no pattern at that range. If I were expecting 20 yard shots, I would shoot a skeet choke. For all else I shoot IC. But, this is my gun, my shooting abilities.

If I am hunting flooded timber then of course my shots are 15-25 yards and with #6 Steel.

Mike, nobody here is telling you how to hunt. I should have been more clear when I said I chew people out for shooting beyond 30yrds, what I meant was when we have birds working, sometimes we get a pass or two where the birds are killable at 30 or so yards. I like to get the birds to decoy. Not saying I don't "pass shoot" birds working the spread, believe me I do and I will when the birds are not working right. That being said, I prefer my ducks feet down over the decoys before I shoot. I rarely have birds destroyed by the shot, I use Winchester Xpert #4's over the decoys. There are times when I do need to dispatch a cripple, it happens, even close range. But nobody is critisizing the way you hunt! I'm not saying outside of 30 yards is skybusting. 50 yards is where I consider skybusting to start. I'm familiar with playing on a soccer field and I know what 50 yards looks like, and that just doubles the chance for a winged bird in my opinion.

The point of the thread was how mainstream duck hunting is portrayed anymore. So called "professional" duck hunters blasting at birds that are sky high. The best waterfowling video's are the Duck Commander. You want to see how I hunt, watch those guys. 90% of the shooting they are doing are at birds stooling over their decoys. Thats just how I do it. I'm not saying that how I do it is the only way.

As far as people shooting over the limit and your comment about gunning over hand carved decoys, I'm not sure where that came from.

One thing about "video" hunting is the lost of depth and distance. This just make alot of hunters think they can shoot long range. Yes I have stretched some shots. A good example is get a decoy and set it at 30 yards stand there look at it then if you have a camera look at it thur the camera with a standard lens. And you can see the paradox effect. Todays hunting shows and DVDs make many think most shots are not that hard to do. When we set our dekes out we set "rangers" out at different distances to help us. I beleive in a good kill not chasing cripples down with the boat.

Rick

Marketing and propaganda!

I've said this for YEARS...These ammo companies have created a generation of skybusters.......The "golden BB" and all it takes is for one of these guys to connect with a 70+ yrd shot just ONCE and they are convienced they can do it all the time.....Its an epidemic in the sport of waterfowling...and its ruining it

David "swampy" L wrote:Marketing and propaganda!

I've said this for YEARS...These ammo companies have created a generation of skybusters.......The "golden BB" and all it takes is for one of these guys to connect with a 70+ yrd shot just ONCE and they are convienced they can do it all the time.....Its an epidemic in the sport of waterfowling...and its ruining it

I couldn't agree more!

Well I hunt with a 40 inch barrel with an Xfull choke with 3 1/2 BBB's for teal and wood ducks I knock em stone dead at 70+ yards
Is that sky busting

roger that Dave!!!

Chris S. wrote:Well I hunt with a 40 inch barrel with an Xfull choke with 3 1/2 BBB's for teal and wood ducks I knock em stone dead at 70+ yards
Is that sky busting

Chris

Thats is no shoulder gun , its a punt gun with a barrel that long.

Davey,

I didn't mean to come off as brash as my post sounded. I had lunch with the "Godfather" today and we were talking about how it is difficult sometimes to get your point across in an e-mail or on a thread. I agree about getting the birds close for a good kill shot but sometimes it depends on how the birds are decoying and what is your shell/choke combo that will ultimately determine how far you will be shooting that day. Since I routinely shoot BC #3, I like farther shots. I like to cover all my bases. I have shot Teal at 20 yards and basically decapitated them. Not something that I want my ducks to look like especially if there is a band.

My post does say that I am not referencing you in terms of killing over the limit and I am sorry if you felt that I was.

In essence we are saying the same thing overall.

BTWI am annoyed that hypersonic advertising feels that we should shoot a hotter/faster load to make up for an inadequate lead on the bird. How about reminding everyone to shoot in front of the bird in a catchy little sticker on the box?

Chris S. wrote:Well I hunt with a 40 inch barrel with an Xfull choke with 3 1/2 BBB's for teal and wood ducks I knock em stone dead at 70+ yards
Is that sky busting

Man I'd sure like to see sooting like that.